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rthstewart) wrote2012-09-09 02:31 pm
a little NFE commentary
So, let’s see. I realized I should probably put up a few notes about my NFE’s. I had a terrible time with posting and I’ve had to do a lot of RL writing. But it's done and up and one part of it in particular, Katyn, deserves special discussion.
Thimbles and Thunderstorms surprised people. It’s G (maybe PG) rated, it’s Silver Chair AU, and interestingly it’s the fluffy counterpoint to ![[livejournal.com profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/external/lj-userinfo.gif){kind=small}
wingedflight21's own Jill/Rilian AU for the NFE (go read it!). It was fun and autumnia was a huge help with the beta.
Narnians Assemble was a much, much harder story. I guessed early on it was intrikate88 as she had been musing about an Edmund/Natasha, Crow/Spider cross for a while. She's got awesome art for it somewhere. I could not have pulled that story together without snacky. Intrikate enjoyed it and that was great. Interestingly which part is a person’s favorite has varied widely. This is all of course what might be called TSG AU, too.
I’d gotten hit recently with complaints about how Rat and Sword Go To War ended. So, now we all know, sort of. Peter gets shot and is sent home. Susan joins another outfit and they are busy blowing stuff up until the liberation of Paris.
The Captain America (20122) timeline is completely whacky and they paid far less attention to it than I did. Handwave.
I had huge, huge problems with Peggy and Susan. I also ended up shipping them very hard (they are very physical with one another so if you want to read something into it, please do and I want to read your fic), but the affection that should have been there just didn’t come out. To the extent that works, it’s all Snacky’s beta. Hayley Atwell, who plays Peggy Carter in the film, mentioned how Peggy is the sort who would dart into the loo to put on a coat of lipstick before dashing out to shoot things and that was, of course, perfect.
And then we have Crow, Spider and Hawk. Edmund and Natasha’s timeline is fine. It’s when she defects and Clint’s age in the Avengers that make no sense. Seriously screwed up timeline, folks. Handwave.
Katyn. I’ve had a lot of requests to deal with Katyn over the years. The particular visit referred to here (there were several) was an American delegation led by the US Ambassador’s daughter Pamela Harriman. The stench and the red gloves come from a Time magazine article. Katyn is so complex and horrible I really do not do it justice. Maybe I’ll go back to it in a different way but for now, it stands as homage to a terrible event and a bridge from Nazi atrocity to Stalinist.
I spent time in that part of the world that Edmund travels in. I had toothless Romanian farmers come up to me in 1992 and say “We’ve been waiting for you since Yalta.” Edmund is describing how it looked in the 50s and 40 years later, it looked exactly the same. The plum brandy was everywhere and came out of used plastic coke bottles from home stills.
The trick of the story was two-fold. The fact is, I don’t like writing Edmund as assassin. His role as compassionate and forgiving, as having fully integrated the concept of grace into his life, is too strong. (which also puts me directly at odds with the Edmund angst stories that are so popular. It's a really unusual characterization I've been working with). So, I had to make him a spy without the killing - which ultimately tied in well with Lucy's story. Second, I had to do it while still preserving Clint’s essential role in being the one who motivates Natasha to defect. And she’s a cold killer. This meant putting Edmund more in the backseat. He's an observer, not the player people might want.
The Hulk movies ends in British Columbia and Bruce Banner's story picks up again in Kolkata in the Avengers movie. Anger is critical part of Bruce's character and in Avengers, Stark tells Bruce that now would be a good time to get angry so he can go all Other Guy. Bruce delivers the line "I'm angry all the time" and I very much see that in the characterization of Lucy that has developed for me. She is valiant, bravely wading in to fight for the weak, the poor, the sick, and the disenfranchised. My gosh she's a pain to be around. There is one nod to Asim there where she mentions having had a spiritual guide for some 10 years. And last, Lucy and Stormybuffin. Also, a 75 year old Lucy on a nude beach with Mark Ruffalo as Bruce Banner. I laughed. I hope you did.
And, I need to thank
snacky again for running a wonderful exchange. A true bright spot apart from the great stories has been that I've gotten to know some new people better, including tantella (the LJ account for Avia Tantella Scott), starbrowsings (Starbrow), heliopausa (Heliopause) and pencildragon11 (oldfashionedgirl95) (and one of her nearest and dearest! Waves!) We've also gotten stories from people who I've admired for a while but haven't seen Narnia work from them ever or in a very long time, including therck, freudiancascade and Ruan Chun XianAnd this is, I remind myself, the real wonder of fanfiction -- the act of creating, the joy of sharing, and the growth that comes from the inclusive, vibrant communities that grow around those creations.
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See for me, this made it work. Because we do NOT see Peggy as a very demonstrative, affectionate person; the handful of tender looks she has for Steve are not public ones, and when his affection for her is publicly perceived (in the newsreel, for example) she is visibly uncomfortable with it. As a result I've inserted my own headcanon that she cannot be these stereotypically feminine things--demonstrative, affectionate--if she wants to keep knocking those doors down, and so that chapter held up VERY well for me as a result.
I think that the sort of affection Peggy is best able to offer, given her circumstances, is that of self-protection in a time of staggeringly high casualty rates. It may not be conventional affection, but I see it as the best gift she has to give anyone, and to see her give that to Susan--yes. It works. Very well.
Save the soft looks for after wartime, and all that, eh?
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One of the things I liked about Narnians Assemble was the sort-of sequel to Rat and Sword, with Peter at home fighting racism and Susan blowing things up (with lipstick!). I also really liked Edmund as spy, documenter of atrocities, and forger, while avoiding Edmund as coldblooded assassin; and the grace and forgiveness he embodies.
My favorite, of course, was Lucy being angry all the time and the reference to Asim and Valiance in Everyday Life. Also the nude beach was . . . interesting. :-D I laughed.
Thanks for the callout!
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I'd had requests for a while to send Edmund to Katyn and had not figured out if I could, or how. I've been thinking about this a lot as I exchanged email with Miniver about the story. I realized that the most popular depiction of Edmund in the fandom focuses upon his traitor status, his lingering guilt and culpability, and the building and destroying and rebuilding of his bond with Peter. Edmund is a very popular vehicle for angst. I've not done that much. Edmund is defined not by guilt, angst or by his relationship with Peter, but by the gift of forgiveness that he receives and now passes on to others -- the line in HHB about how even a traitor may mend -- that to me is the starting point of Edmund's character -- conversion, transformation, redemption, and grace. Anastigmat said that she saw Edmund as a profoundly empathetic character and she's right. He is truly transformed by grace and having received that gift he doesn't continually examine why he wasn't worthy -- no one is worthy, as he points out, except maybe Lucy. This empathy/grace allows him to see the very worst that humanity can do, fairly adjudge the most vile crime and craven murderer, and still respond with compassion and forgiveness and offer the possibility of redemption. Ahem. sorry. but I've been thinking about this a lot.
I did do the ZOMG I'M NOT WORTHY TRAITOR FANDOM TROPE HOLEY SMOKES THERE'S TURKISH DELIGHT CUE PTSD in H&M when the Turkish delight lands on the breakfast table and even there, he is not paralyzed by horror/fear/angst (or if he is, it's a moment) and then he sees it for what it is, a warning. He does think that Morgan will leave him once she learns that he was a traitor, which she responds to with the typical, "oh don't be stupid, Harold" though I was careful to do that scene from her pov rather than his to avoid buckets of I'm not worthy navel-gazing. As that relationship has developed, I've further realized that Morgan's support and love for him, even knowing the truth, is significantly affirming. I've not been called on it, but Edmund's transformation by love and grace is the most overtly Christian part of my work.
Sigh.
And as for the nude beach, well, I figure that at age 76, and perpetually on the short list for the Nobel Prize for Peace, and a direct line to Aslan, world renowned humanitarian and mass grave investigator Doctor Lucy Pevensie can do pretty much whatever she likes. Maybe "Go to a nude beach" is on her bucket list! And... well... you know there probably were not bathing suits in Narnia... Time to get out the worldbuilding blocks.
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The line in HHB is crucial. It's hard to break out of the tropes and see how a character can be defined by conversion and redemption, but I really love how you've done it with Edmund. He's a fascinating, inspiring character. "This empathy/grace allows him to see the very worst that humanity can do, fairly adjudge the most vile crime and craven murderer, and still respond with compassion and forgiveness and offer the possibility of redemption." That's very Christlike.
Heh heh, Turkish Delight. Doing that from Morgan's perspective *would* help avoid the navel-gazing. (Speaking of Morgan, I just saw a sign for Morgan Stanley the other day.)
Hmm. You know, I'd completely forgotten about it, but I think "Go to a nude beach" used to be on my bucket list. I think it *does* sound like fun. And then, yes, the mermaids didn't wear seashells. (Why do mermaids wear seashells? Because B-shells are too small.)
Ah, worldbuilding.
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lucy nude beach at 75
BYW-I agree totally with your view that Edmund has too much compassion to ever lose his morals completely, even as a spy. He would never dishonor Morgan's memory by losing himself in Spare Oom because he knows he will answer to both her and Aslan one day (and I think he'd probably be more afraid of Morgan). Great story, in case I didn't mention it. Loved this further look into the Rat and Sword and Apolistic Way worlds. I can't wait to hear more about Edmund's time in Washington as a "bag carrier". Wonder if there will be handball?
Re: lucy nude beach at 75
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Thimbles and Thunderstorms was, indeed, a surprise - but it was so lovely; I don't actually know if I ever left a review on it? In any case, it was adorable and also I thought some really good Rilian characterization re: the trauma of the LotGK and relationships. Plus, I saw what you did there with the Duke's daughter of Galma!
Re: timelines in Narnians Assemble - handwave is right. It worked out totally well, I think especially because you did pay outright attention to Edmund's and Natasha's various ages and appearances, and maybe I just don't pay enough attention to these sorts of things, but I didn't notice anything weird about Clint's time.
And I DESPERATELY want someone to write the Peggy/Susan sequel, because they were perfect and I can completely see what you wrote of their mentoring relationship and comradeship in war turning naturally into other demonstrations of affection.
Also I like your Edmund characterization, if I've never actually said that? I can get behind him as the spymaster, totally (which you do have) and sometimes, depending on the writing, as assassin, but I love what you do with grace aspect.
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